You go littlecitywitch. I actually just want to reply to a few things mentioned here after reading everything.
Well this is some bullshit if I ever saw it.
I strongly disagree with fuckyeahpaganism on this one, and feel sad that that’s the response the questioner received. Santeria is of course interesting, as are all syncretic spiritualities (of which Wicca is one, lest we forget), but I don’t feel like it would be what the questioner is asking for, especially since Santeria and many other infusions of Christianity with indigenous folk practices are incredibly culturally specific. Fuckyeahpaganism is correct in that it might be hard to find a group to practice with - traditional Wiccans can be incredibly staunchy and orthopraxic and often even raise their eyebrows at me because I dig spirits more than deities. However, I would strongly encourage the querant not to give up. There is not one Wicca, there are many - and there are multiple versions of Christianity, as well. I could definitely see it being possible to infuse Wicca with Christianity. Some forms of Christianity already honour a holy trinity, and it would be a simple thing to replace worship of a central mother goddess and father god with the Virgin Mary and Jesus, or a similar concoction which resonates with you. I am always skeptical of those who draw lines between religions. Religion continues to be (and always has been) alive, constantly shifting, changing, morphing, and influencing other religions. Don’t be afraid to walk the path that feels like home just because you haven’t seen anyone else do it yet. There are many others out there who feel like you do - you just gotta find them. Don’t ever let anyone tell you that your beliefs are wrong or incompatible with the world. They aren’t.
I hope the asker sees this. Best of luck to them on their journey, and to all who feel lost.
There are many Christian Pagans / Wiccans and I am so sick of people saying otherwise or treating them poorly. It is NOT all or nothing. It is NOT either / or.
Except with Wicca it is either/or. Wicca is a British religion that worships the Lord and Lady of the Isles. The word Isles refers to the British Isles versus the land of Judea.
Though knowing Gardner he more than likely based the Lord of the Isles also called the Horned God after Satan. However the only people who know the identity of the Lord and Lady of the Isles are those who have initiated.
For more information on Wicca, I suggest that everyone signs up at the Amber and Jet mailing list to get information on what Wicca is actually about and stop with the damn misinformation.
There is more than one form of Wicca. Not everyone follows a specific tradition. Just as there are eclectic Wiccans, there can be and are Christian Wiccans.
Sorry, but that religion has grown and changed and is no longer just Gardnerian.
There’s Alexandrian, Moshian and Central Valley.
And under Central Valley there’s: , Silver Crescent, Daoine Core, Majestic, Greencraft, Majestic, Kingstone, and Assembly of Wicca.
All traditions follow the core that Gardner created.
Eclectic Wicca and Christian Wicca do not follow the core.
Eclectic Wicca is Eclectic Neo-Paganism mislabeled. Christianity and Wicca have nothing in common with each other. An orthodoxy and orthopraxy can’t go together. (Right belief and right practice). Mixing the two is like mixing motor oil with rum or something.
Seriously..this supporting this kind of cultural appropriation (which it is since Wicca is not open to everyone. Before someone can be considered a Wiccan they must be determined to be a Proper Person) is kinda..hypocritical don’t you think? How can any of us take you seriously on cultural appropriation when you approve of a form of it? :s
I agree. Christianity is very dogmatic. If you don’t do or believe in XYZ, you’re a heretic, and out of the club. That’s why there’s a million different sects, who think that every other sect is heretical. But deep down inside they still share the core belief that Jesus is the Savior. The core of Wicca is worship of the duality Lord and Lady. So the two are mutually exclusive, having different deities and all.
As a Puerto Rican, all I can say is a “white”/non-hispanic/non-carribean person who practices Santeria is cultural appropriation. When practiced outside of Caribbean Hispanic culture, it loses it meaning, as it’s derived from the forced conversion of African slaves, who wanted to keep their religious practices, but didn’t want to get in trouble.
Aite, here we go:
Mischeviousfae - It sounds like you have some reading of history books to catch up on re: origins of Wicca. I’m happy to provide a list of historical works I’d recommend on that topic, if you’re interested! And that link you provided? Yeah, it contains some misinformation. 1734 is not a Wiccan group, nor has it ever been, as it clearly states on its website. The Clan of Tubal Cain is a traditional British witchcraft group which is Luciferian in nature - I would not lump it together with Wicca, as the beliefs and practices are not remotely the same. Traditional British Wicca and traditional British witchcraft are two very different things. It’s interesting that you put people in the direction of a site which aims to include non-Wiccan traditional witchcraft under its umbrella, as traditional British witchcraft historically has been very much a dual-faith practice that was heavily influenced by Christianity and the inclusion of Christian verses as charms and spells.
There are many traditions of Wicca that do not fall into the short list you’ve provided. Your definition of Wicca is a bit outdated, I daresay; at the very least you should refer to the specific tradition to which you belong and/or speak for. Furthermore, please stop suggesting that things can or can’t be practiced or believed based on one’s blood quantum. That is some essentialization if I have ever seen it, and is for sure a case of policing. Such notions of ‘purity’ are incredibly disturbing and I suggest you check yourself.
Dreamsofinfinite - Hi! So what is this uniform ‘Christianity’ of which you speak? Christianity cannot just be broken down to Catholicism and Protestantism, the various interpretations of the Bible are never ending. If you’ve done your reading (which you clearly have not), you would know that many writers whose views came to influence the creation of Wicca, in their extrapolations on the nature of deity, saw Jesus as one of many dying and resurrecting gods. They saw a connection. (If you want to know about the development of the idea of the dying/resurrecting god in Neopaganism as it relates to Wicca, what writers I’m talking about, etc, let me know and I’m happy to share that information as well as my academic sources.) Why is that connection difficult for you to see? Why must we impose binaries on things all the time?
I feel inclined to mention the Bugis in Australasia. They’re Muslim, and yet they engage in mediumship, spirit worship, and elaborate rituals which one could call magical in nature. In the BBC’s Around the World in 80 Faiths, participant-observer and Christian priest Peter Owen Jones asks some of the practitioners if they find the mix between spirit worship, mediumship, and Islam to be at odds. They strongly said NO, that they saw these practices as one and the same. After his encounter with them, Jones says this, which I find to be emblematic of the conversation we’re having here:
“Is it islam with nature worship, or is it nature worship with islam? I think that it’s both. And as much as I might have found that confusing, the Bugis, the ones who actually worship god in this manner, don’t find it confusing at all. They don’t have the need to package things in one single box.”
A British religion? Sure it was created in Britian but honestly it’s not founded by British beliefs and practices in any shape or form but rather Gerald Gardner took pieces from both Europe and Asia and blended them together. The Threefold Law? Ya. Obviously based on karma from Asia. I don’t think the British ever believed in karma. Reincarnation? Same thing. The casting of circles and the way rituals are done, ritual tools, invoking the 4 quarters, the degree system, and initiation? Influenced by Freemasonry and especially by his good old Aleister Crowley and The Golden Dawn. If you can find proof that any of those were practiced by the British and were a part of their culture prior to Gardner then perhaps. However Wicca is a new religion funded by different views, beliefs, and practices both East and West. It never was just worshipping the deities of the British Isles. The Goddess and God concept, and the belief of a Horned God and Triple Goddess worshiped by an ancient religion in Britain came from Margaret Murray’s publications during his time and he was influenced by the Goddess cults, and the theory that the Witch-cults were based on a Pre-Christian religion mentioned by Murray, which has long been proven as false. There is no actual proof the early people from the British Isles worshiped a Goddess and God especially the one found in Wicca, or at least Gardnerian Wicca. Again this relates to the cultural appropriation comment. How is that cultural appropriation when one, the British never practiced a religion like this nor did they do any of the type of rituals seen today or the Witchcraft seen in Wicca, and two it’s a religion not a culture nor is it a religion formed by one culture but my a man who incorporated so many influences into it. Honestly that whole thing just….*shakes head*